Set the Controls for Fan-Band Drama
November 12th, 2008 by jjbtags: photo, live
During Billy Corgan’s rant-remake encore of “Everything Is Beautiful” tonight at Constitution Hall in Washington, the audience member pictured — who was agitated following the Smashing Pumpkins’ set-closing post-rock take on “Set the Controls for the Heart of the Sun” — extended two middle fingers toward the singer.
Called upon by Corgan to express his dissatisfaction, the young man yelled something to the effect that the band no longer rocks. A question as to the whereabouts of James Iha was also raised. Corgan’s response was to bring a young female fan on stage, referring to her as “James Iha” and asking her what she was doing since having left the band.
Pretty good show, otherwise, but that’s not what many of us were talking about as we exited the building. The segment of the show from “Transformer” through “The Rose March” was particularly energizing and impressive — and a bit of semi-confrontational banter from Billy immediately thereafter (and prior to “Today”) came off quite funny and ingratiating. And then…did it all go wrong?
November 12th, 2008 at 12:44 am
wow american audience is realy dumb …
why didnt someone just kick that guy???
November 12th, 2008 at 1:10 am
i don’t get it, i’m digging the post 2000 Pink Floydish Pumpkins….and i have been a fan since 94….bands change, you just gotta except it if you love them and move on…the fact that people have Pumpkins eras stuck in there brain is lost on me…
November 12th, 2008 at 1:12 am
oh and, i wish the Pumpkins would just do the really expensive small scale shows so we can weed the fly by night fans out!
November 12th, 2008 at 1:39 am
the thing is, it appears like this guy was in one of the first rows of seats.. therefore he not only is probably a big fan.. but he also probably spent alot of money on tickets.
People will be assholes. We just have to deal with it.
November 12th, 2008 at 1:59 am
i hate set the controls… hate it. but i love that they are trying something new. i had the discussion leaving the ac show with a friend… if they do something i don’t like (set the controls, the new hmm) that still puts the percentage of smashing pumpkins music i like at something like 98% as opposed to 99%. at this point billy has proved to me (which really matters, i know) that he can write fantastic music. i’ll give an honest listen to literally anything he attempts. maybe it’s good or maybe it’s bad…. either way i love that my favorite artist will take a chance and not be some lame fuckaround who writes the same album over and over and names it something different….
captcha: crazed $60,000
November 12th, 2008 at 2:14 am
joe: it appears like this guy was in one of the first rows of seats
He was about 12-15 rows from the stage.
November 12th, 2008 at 2:20 am
Billy needs to chill. Is he going to bring someone up on stage every time someone yells something he doesnt like?
November 12th, 2008 at 5:08 am
Does seem weird this kind of thing has started happend so close to the release of the DVD.
November 12th, 2008 at 5:55 am
Maybe it is the most bizzare PR campaign ever assembled for IAGW but then again that doesnt hold much water. What I don’t get is why Corgan even acknowledges these people. If you are faced with an entire venue shouting you suck then yes complain, throw a fit do whatever, but just one jackass in a sea of people who are most proabably digging the show, why bother? If that guy hasn’t read a recent album sleeve/interview/anything reguarding the reformation of the band and doesnt realise that Mr.Iha isn’t involved then fuck him.
November 12th, 2008 at 6:33 am
i would say that if you’re not pissing someone in the crowd off, then you’re not doing your job as an artist. so why not acknowledge those people? they have a right to be pissed off, and you have a right to piss them off.
i’ll even give this guy credit. middle fingers, i think, are the way to go when it comes to airing ones grievances at a rock show with minimal detriment to the enjoyment of other concertgoers.
November 12th, 2008 at 8:31 am
They were sitting 2 rows behind me. I’m starting to buy the whole “staged” theory a bit as I didn’t hear a peep from them prior to Set the Controls. During StC, they started chanting for Starla and then saying shit like “Billy you faggot! I used to think you were cool!” It could have been real though, who knows. Aside from those 4 kids however, the crowd seemed to be really into the show. Not a bad crowd at all and the band seemed like they were having fun all night. I met a lot of great fans and had a great time myself. Can’t wait for tonight. I got a ticket for free from a guy that posts on Netphoria and works for DAR. It’s actually 4 rows closer than my 4 star VIP ticket that I paid $125 for :)
November 12th, 2008 at 9:32 am
Entertaining post about the concert here:
http://www.jasonrodriguez.com/2008/11/smashing-pumpkins-11112008-dar.html
Also, having been seated very close to this, I have the opposite reaction to seign — there’s no way this was staged. Perhaps people are sort of coming prepared to do this, i.e., they’ve read about Set the Controls/etc. and they are anticipating the opportunity to yell shit, but this was not a setup by the band.
That said, Billy’s rant basically begs and pleads for a response like this to materialize from someone.
rC: “shot enjoyed”
November 12th, 2008 at 10:20 am
nothing quite so extreme happened at the cleveland show, but on a few occasions billy encouraged fans to “get it out.” and he called out the one guy who “lost his virginity to 1979.” i see a pattern emerging of billy seeming to realize fans are pissed off and he is responding to it. the thing is, only a few fans are actually pissed. i agree with the commenter above that took issue with him bothering to respond to a minority. most people appreciate what the pumpkins are doing. i wish he would acknowledge them. even on “everything is beautiful” when he talks about having the best fans, i sense sarcasm in that. i feel like he’s letting the little bit of negativity overwhelm the positivity.
November 12th, 2008 at 10:55 am
I agree with what david and Not Important and others have said, except I also think it’s been a “problem” of his for a long while, and it’s pretty frustrating from a fan standpoint when you are one of the people enjoying what he’s doing.
November 12th, 2008 at 11:23 am
jjb, you could very well be right. I just thought it was odd that I didn’t hear a peep out of them until Set the Controls started. And they obviously knew the song because they started in on dissing Billy almost immediately after it started. On retrospect, you’re most likely right and it wasn’t staged. In fact, looking at the picture of the guy, I think he may be the same person that was hanging out in the Men’s room trying to buy “cheap weed” off of everyone that entered.
November 12th, 2008 at 1:11 pm
you mean he was one of the college bros who is not willing to invest in his drugs?
November 12th, 2008 at 1:37 pm
Dude, no joke. I am that dude in the picture.
In all honesty, I’ve spent 1000’s of dollars on the pumpkins. I’ve been a fan since I Gish, and amongst my friends, I have often been labeled Smashing Pumpkins apologist.
But when the band plays a FULL 10 PART KAZOO encore after shitting on fans a few times during the night, I gave him 2 middle fingers. you have GOT to be kidding me. 70 bucks for a 10 man kazoo song? They’ve lost it.
When he called me out, I unashamedly let him know how i felt.
BTW pot is lame. but not as lame as kazoo arraignments of mellon collie b-sides.
ALSO, what happened to encores like vieuphoria’s silver fuck/jackboot? I’m not saying to play that again, i understand progress. but FUCKING KAZOOS?
November 12th, 2008 at 1:46 pm
Dude!
November 12th, 2008 at 2:14 pm
Kazoo encore would piss me off as well. But the reviews have been out on this tour for several months - it was pretty easy to find out that they’d probably do the kazoo encore. If that’s not your bag, why would you even go to the show?
November 12th, 2008 at 2:16 pm
Most people are passive in reality. Isn’t that obvious? It’s not just a “few” people like you apologist like to think. I really doubt a majority of people hear HOTS and think, “Wow, what a great use of time and that was so totally worth all my money!”.
I’m all for a grassroots movement/campaign to end HOTS.
When or if he comes to Houston, me and my friends are going to bring picket signs. If he’ll ask one of us to come up on stage, we’ll give him an actual criticism. Not bullshit like, “The show sucked!”. That doesn’t explain anything.
What is he going to say to an actual person who says, “I didn’t pay to hear you do an overlong cover, I came to hear Pumpkin songs”. Fuck you? And if he asks if we want our money back, we’ll say, “No, no, keep your money for the pumpkin songs but for the time you spend on playing covers, you pay us”. Cause, that’s how it should work. If the song is punitive and self-indulgent, then buddy you’re going to have to pay me to listen to that shit.
November 12th, 2008 at 2:25 pm
To clarify:
I didn’t say the show sucked, i didn’t say he sucked.
My initial comment (although yelled at him when he asked what my problem was) was, “This sucks, you used to be my favorite band, what happened?”
I don’t know a better way to express disillusionment.
fucking KAZOOS. and billy playing a random DRUM? the audience sitting down half the set?
If that’s what he’s calling show business, wtf.
November 12th, 2008 at 2:41 pm
Calvin, I feel your pain. When I ‘heard’ here that they were concluding with kazoos and a Mungo Jerry cover, I was appalled, -and honestly waked out at the show when it commenced (even though I was happy to hear ‘We Only Come Out at Night’ -walked out anyway). I was sure happy I walked back in though as that was when Billy Sr. came out and played!
Nothing stops anyone from walking out. Still a good sum of show for your money…
It took me upwards of 24 hours of thought and wretchedness in wtf? land (yea too much introspection) about the encore. Came to my own conclusion that it ‘worked’ from an art performance stand point, -was satisfied with that. (subjective anyhow)
Curiously, ‘Everyone is beautiful’ -’works’ from this standpoint in that it becomes nice or nasty depending on the audience reaction to the show itself. It’s almost relative that the ppl most offended by it already disliked the show and it sorta curiously is a reflection on the audience. (very deliberately so, as BC works the sarcasm in direct relation to how well he feels the show was received?)
Toronto, which was probably the most ‘benign’ performances of it so far (being one of the nicer audience receptions so far) -this kazoo encore is so funny I burst out laughing multiple times, so, since that’s not easy, I’m satisfied with any performer that can make me guffaw uncontrollably over and over.
November 12th, 2008 at 2:54 pm
Oh man - they do the kazoo thing every night? I honestly thought they did it as a “fuck you” to a shitty audience.
I should have been reading up on their recent concerts, it seems.
November 12th, 2008 at 3:22 pm
Jason, in your blog you said this was an F U encore. If it was an F U encore they would have played An Ode To No One
November 12th, 2008 at 3:35 pm
Nah, it would have went over the audiences’ head - folks would just be excited the Pumpkins decided to play a fourth Mellon Collie song…A kazoo encore felt like a real “fuck you” encore. But, guess I was wrong. Weird. I still enjoyed the show. Audience still sucked, though.
November 12th, 2008 at 3:36 pm
I honestly don’t mind HOTS that much. I kinda like it. In fact, I’m listening right now to a recording of HOTS from 2008-04-04, an earlier incarnation of the song that only clocks in at around 8 min 30 s. This version is much more concise, and totally rocks as it leads right into United States to close the set.
Not to be a total apologist here, but I also think the kazoo thing is awesome. Generally, I’d prefer to hear NEW takes on old songs… especially minor works like WOCOAN… I mean, I doubt anyone is so attached to the album version of WOCOAN that they’re disappointed at not hearing the song in its original form.
November 12th, 2008 at 3:56 pm
“I don’t know a better way to express disillusionment.
fucking KAZOOS. and billy playing a random DRUM? the audience sitting down half the set?
If that’s what he’s calling show business, wtf.”
If you want show business, go to Vegas and see Prince play the same show every night.
And seriously, if you can’t appreciate the hilarity of kazoos as an instrument then there is no talking to you. You’re not a fan of the show, fine, but heckling is just a waste of time. But with that said, the Corgan and “mock James Iha” conversation that sprung out as a result sounds funny.
“Generally, I’d prefer to hear NEW takes on old songs… especially minor works like WOCOAN… I mean, I doubt anyone is so attached to the album version of WOCOAN that they’re disappointed at not hearing the song in its original form.”
Agreed, and this is where some of the audience reaction loses me because this is an old song. Sure it’s “dude, FUCKIN’ kazoos” but it’s still the song and is pretty true to the spirit of the song and definitely is on mark with the original arrangement. Why would you want to hear them doing it the same way in concert as it is on the album? Kind of defeats the purpose of going to a show. Maybe you wanted to hear “Geek USA” or something instead…..that’s something different, but complaining about a different way of playing a song? Whatever. That being said, if they figured out how to do that song well with playing water-glasses and triangles I’d still be find with that.
November 12th, 2008 at 4:04 pm
I, for one, am quite excited to see SP pulling out different instruments on stage to create sounds, and really hope it translates to their upcoming studio material. It’s the dimension of SP that has always fascinated me, and which Ive found more on the “lacking” side of things since zeitgeist (despite Neverlost and Pomp which both incorporated new sounds to the SP sound palette).
All that to say, I find the kazoos to be a much-needed hilarious release of all the seriousness that surrounds the Pumpkins.
November 12th, 2008 at 4:07 pm
I thought the kazoos were funny in Hammond in August.
I wish fans would bring kazoos too and play along, those that know about it.
When I saw mum last year they were selling little kazoos and cheap harmonicas with their logo on them, and you were invited to play along during one of the songs. That was fun and a nice little band-crowd interaction moment. Of course it was at a really tiny venue.
November 12th, 2008 at 4:16 pm
A few other thoughts:
When I first heard that SP was reviving/reuniting/returning (whatever you want to call it), I was highly skeptical. Despite having been a fan for many years, I was afraid that SP might come back having lost the energy that originally made me a fan. I was afraid that they might fade away doing greatest hits tours, a cover band for their own songs.
I was pleasantly surprised when I heard both Zeitgeist and the residency shows material: the band hasn’t abandoned the creative energy that launched and carried their career in the first place. And since reviving they’ve continued to do interesting things (with varying degrees of success, admittedly): the residencies and performance of freshly written songs, the open-taping policy, the american gothic ep, the internet release of superchrist video (complete with seeds geezers), the crazy covers including HOTS etc. (with timpanis!), the revival of old material from their archives (e.g. Set the Ray to Jerry at the Detroit Oct 2007 show, Translucent in Asheville, and so on), the release of GLOW on guitar hero, the constant evolution of their website (introducing PMM articles, for instance), the If All Goes Wrong documentary, the 20th anniversary tour with 2-night sets, and the expansion to a 9-piece ensemble with horns and an effing double violin. This probably isn’t an exhaustive list. My point is that SP (or billy/jimmy, whatever) continue to find new ways to be creative forces in rock music. I respect their persistence, and most of the time, I find what they do to be very good.
I listen to many audience recordings of their shows, and the material I most often skip over are the Cherub Rocks, songs that have never evolved much and have never really been retired for long enough to make their current inclusion in the setlist interesting. Bottom line: the moment SP becomes simply a “regurgitate the greatest hits” band and ceases to innovate and surprise me, well, that will probably be the moment I stop listening.
November 12th, 2008 at 4:42 pm
More coverage of Calvin’s shenanigans here:
http://www.brightestyoungthings.com/live-dc/it-happened-last-night-a-smashing-pumpkins-show/
November 12th, 2008 at 5:28 pm
Self-Respecting Brain :
It’s your point of view…I respect it..
But if I can give you an advise (to you and others that complain, for good or bad reasons whatever ):
If it’s really what you think.. just DON’T GO to their show (anymore) and listen to your favorite SP songs home…it’s as simple as that.
just move on..
November 12th, 2008 at 6:04 pm
maybe i’m missing something here, but it ALL came across to me as a pre-planned faked skit - i.e. WWF… or whatever that fake wrastlin’ show is called.
they rehearsed it.
(but not enough… as that guy was a really bad actor. and corgan could brush up on his acting too. although he may have wanted their acting to be really bad - so people would get that it was faked! )
that’s just MY opinion. i too had lunch at the whitehouse this week.
November 12th, 2008 at 6:23 pm
I can totally sympathize with those who think the repeated jamming was a bit much, specifically during the first night shows, but We Only Come out at Night was just awesome (and it’s not a b-side). To each his own I suppose, but that put a huge smile on my face. Let’s be real here, it’s WOCOAN, the song is lighthearted to begin with. If they had come out and did Tonight Tonight on kazoos then you might have a point.
Like I said in another post, 95% of the audience was sitting down during Bodies in NYC so the blame lies as much on the audience as the band. I suppose everyone there figured Bodies was a b-side too. They definitely need to reign in the unnecessary jamming but the shows were still awesome.
I can’t understand why people still go to shows anyway when they don’t want to hear anything post-1995. I would’ve thought the Adore and Machina tours would’ve weeded those people out.
November 12th, 2008 at 7:07 pm
B side = Not a single. WOCOAN is a great song, but let’s be honest, it’s buried on disc 2 of a double album. And on the album is interesting. On kazoo, it’s a bit corny.
A 30 minute cover of a pink floyd song where billy is playing a tribal drum poorly is enough to upset even those hardcore fans that love adore and machina (and even machina 2!).
It’s unreal that they are doing this on a 20th anniversary tour.
Plus these tickets are really expensive. Twice as much as the last time I saw them at the Machina tour. And the venue was half capacity.
If the audience is sitting down, it’s the band’s fault. It blows my mind that a band like the Pumpkins are shitting the bed with this one. They ought to take a page out of My Bloody Valentine’s reunion book and learn how to rock crowds.
Pumpkins are victims of Billy’s own hubris. Playing to half empty concert halls, over-charging for tickets, boring their fans, and picking fights with their audience. It’s a good thing he’s already rich and living off the residuals of his early 90’s success.
November 12th, 2008 at 10:06 pm
Goddamnit, it’s the Siamese Dream tour all over again.
November 12th, 2008 at 10:07 pm
just becasue someone is in the front doesnt mean they are a fan. Tickets in the first 7 rows from the stage are now 40 50 and 60 dollars each on broker sites on this tour. LESS than the high up seats and vip.
November 12th, 2008 at 10:48 pm
melabonbon - absolutely brilliant idea!
I say all the real fans bring KAZOO’s and that will make Billy and the whole band smile…blow the bad vibes right out of the room. The rest can leave if they don’t like it.
I have yet to figure out why you would go to a show that you do not enjoy? I don’t go to a show or to see a band I don’t like…and say that they owe me a good time? I choose whether or not I have a good time or not. Really in the scheme of things…after the band has given so much to their fans over the years and played some really great music since 1992…does it really matter if they have a little fun to blow off some steam at the end of a show with a few kazoos? The intention is good, to lighten things up and have fun?
Hey! I will be upfront in the VIP Section with my kazoo if anyone else wants to have a good time :) Maybe they will sign a few? See ya there!
November 12th, 2008 at 10:50 pm
Oh…oops…since what 1985? Sorry…I am a new fan :) I don’t have time to study every detail…but you get the idea….
November 12th, 2008 at 11:34 pm
FACT: The guy in the photo is producing my band’s record. So don’t hate.
November 13th, 2008 at 6:03 am
i’d rather want to see the band on their own instrument than kazoo. i’d rather want to see Billy on his guitar than on timpani. what’s wrong with saying so? those are reasonable opinions. if someone say they dont like set the control and i am one pt2, i totally understand. to call those audience untroo fans is totally pathetic. of course it’s ok if you enjoy kazoo, timpani, etc. but to accuse “opponents” with dirty words is totally unacceptable.
i think the recent shows are awesome. i agree with the opinion that they play almost 2 hours of great set, so they should be allowed to indulge in 30-40min of experimental/fun stuffs. but it is leaving bitter aftertaste, that’s it.
November 13th, 2008 at 6:44 am
Im from Brazil and my good girl CK was in the show last night. I am a fan since 1993 and I am 30 years old now. You americans are too polite. This guy would probably be kicked on his backs (not butt) in Brazil for interupting the show and annoying like that. Smashing Pumpkins are one great band and of course the perspective we have towards the band right now is a lot different from the time we were 16.
Anyways, I thought it would be quite funny watching the show last night. I wonder if anyone ever yelled at this dude.
November 13th, 2008 at 8:05 am
@life is good: which show are you going to?
November 13th, 2008 at 8:49 am
If you wanna read Calvin’s account of the story, here you are:
www.brightestyoungthings.com/live-dc/it-happened-last-night-a-smashing-pumpkins-show
I spoke to him extensively after the show. This was not a hoax, this was the real deal holyfield. My dude was really pissed off.
November 13th, 2008 at 10:51 am
@ryma -
Yeah, this is some reverse psychology mindfuck where they attempt to manipulate public opinion by hiring an actor to yell out that they suck, then their press agent plants homophobic allegations in the newspapers. Riiight.
I support them as artists. If they want to charge huge prices for tickets, call this a ‘20th anniversary’ tour, then shit on the expectations on long time fans by playing 20 min kazoo solos, then they should be prepared to deal with the audience reactions.
November 13th, 2008 at 10:52 am
Yeah you are a real fan if you would rather hear a 20 minute kazoo and kettle drum medley instead of soma or geek usa. Give me a break.
November 13th, 2008 at 12:12 pm
@redmond
They’re doing 5 hours worth of music over 2 nights, less than an hour of which is jamming. Would you rather they played the same 1.5 hour set over 2 nights like any other band would do? I never thought I’d hear songs like Eye, Transformer, TBITEITB, Landslide, Bodies, I Am One Part II or WOCOAN performed live. and I still got to hear Bullet, Tonight, Today, Cherub Rock, Zero, 1979, Soma, Disarm etc. etc. What else could you possibly ask for?
Sure I could sit there all night as they played Purr Snickety, Apathy’s Last Kiss, Snail, Siamese Dream, Meladori Magpie, Thru the Eyes of Ruby, Cherry, the Sacred + Profane, Once in a While, Home, Pug etc. etc. but you can’t have everything. Sure I would’ve loved to hear 3-4 of those songs instead of the unnecessary extra 12 minutes or so of HOTS but if that ruins the other 2 hours they played for, then that’s your own hangup.
@reggie
B-side = non-album track. WOCOAN is not a b-side. 1979 is buried on disc 2 of a double album also. And of COURSE it’s corny. Anything played on kazoo’s is going to be corny, but it was FUN.
November 13th, 2008 at 12:19 pm
the good, the band, and the ugly
LOL
November 13th, 2008 at 12:20 pm
i think billy needs this to fuel his writing. i like where as rome burns and sounds of silence are going.. stay pissed billy stay pissed, and write angry songs and let it all out
November 13th, 2008 at 12:32 pm
Calvin you are a piece of shit. They dont do this ending at every concert they play, just something they do now. Just chill out and wait for the next tour. Shit, first concert i went to with them they ended with Zero and Lucky 13. In hammond they ended with kazoos. How crazy is that, i thought it was great. You are entitled to your opinion but dont be a fuck and interrupt the damn show. If you were at my show you would have ruined it for me. Dont do that to fans, please. Just have a good time and enjoy the pumpkins craziness and go to the next tour and see what crazy adventure happens.
November 13th, 2008 at 1:57 pm
@skullivan-
I think they are artists and should play whatever they feel like playing, I think fans who have paid a lot of money for tickets to a ‘20th anniversary show’ have a right to express their opinions, especially if asked. And I certainly don’t think they’re any less of a fan for it either. Who does BC think he is being ‘confrontational’ with in choosing such a controversial setlist anyway? The fly by night MTV jock fans are long gone, these are his hardcore fans.
November 13th, 2008 at 2:16 pm
Billy invited Calvin onto the stage. Calvin didn’t bully his way up there. Billy asked Calvin for his opinion. Calvin didn’t grab the mic and force it on him.
Calvin said the truth as he felt it right to Billy’s face and in front of all present. I guess the truth hurts. I mean, isn’t Billy the guy who’s always going on and on about honesty?
Billy, on the other hand, just trashed the guy as he being led away. Clearly, Billy wanted to nail him in front of everybody and instead it was the other way around.
Billy got owned. Deal with it.
November 13th, 2008 at 2:36 pm
LMFAO at some girl as James Iha
November 13th, 2008 at 2:54 pm
DavidW, i believe you’re getting your fan-band-drama incidents confused. two separate events: “last night sucked” guy onstage in NYC & “where’s James” guy shouting from the floor in DC. and it seems to me Billy took both in stride (i can’t believe anyone thinks “Take Your Dick Out Of My Ass” was anything but a silly, good-humored jab - he sure didn’t sound “hurt”), and yes, he encouraged them to happen in the first place. as you said, he’s about honesty. there is, however, a marked difference when it comes to (uninvited) heckling and booing, as that detracts from the enjoyment of other fans. middle fingers all the way, people.
November 13th, 2008 at 3:02 pm
@tcm - Calvin was saying ‘this sucks’ and flipping him off - there’s a guy like this at every concert. Billy stopped the show, turned on the lights, had a several-minute stand off with this guy, then abruptly ended the show because he couldn’t think of a better comeback than ‘take your cock out of my ass’ but he had already used that one the night before. Who’s detracting from the enjoyment of the fans more?
November 13th, 2008 at 3:23 pm
@redmond: abruptly ended the show? it was already the last song. and bringing the random girl up on stage sounds… enjoyable. admittedly i wasn’t there.
the fact that there’s always a guy (or many guys) like this is all the more reason to comment on it. if he were an anomaly, we could ignore it. but this is a significant phenomenon. or some shit.
November 13th, 2008 at 4:45 pm
Oh sorry, guess I got this confused with the other thing.
Either way though, Billy’s behavior is just gratuitous and ugly. Why does he think that to maintain his artistry (or “alternativeness”) he has to always be such a pain? I’m not saying he has to be Mr. Rogers. I know it’s rock & roll and all. But even by Billy Corgan standards this kinda stuff is pretty asshole-ish.
November 14th, 2008 at 10:30 am
Another really good read on the Washington “Black Sunshine” show is here:
http://silversoundz.blogspot.com/2008/11/alive-and-kicking-and-screaming-part-1.html
November 14th, 2008 at 11:50 am
(11:14 AM) jillysp: i don’t think i would’ve imagined that rolling stone would be linking to us for a hundred years
(11:14 AM) jillysp: i mean i hoped
(11:14 AM) jillysp: but i didn’t expect it
(11:14 AM) jjb: all we had to do was provide grist for some billy-related “controversy”
(11:14 AM) jjb: haha
(11:14 AM) jjb: which maybe we didn’t think we’d ever do
(11:14 AM) jillysp: this is the stuff we joke about
(11:14 AM) jillysp: but it actually happened
(11:15 AM) jillysp: iirc, we’d had this conversation as a joke six months ago or so
(11:15 AM) jillysp: like, ‘let’s report something really negative as a farce to get people to pick us up”
(11:15 AM) jillysp: oh, it happened
(11:16 AM) jillysp: it also shows that big pubs are digging deeper and more pathetically for ‘news’
(11:16 AM) jillysp: not that it’s a shocker
(11:17 AM) jjb: well, i think it’s good that they dig deeper. though not when they are simultaneously ignoring the new york times’ coverage
(11:18 AM) jillysp: “Did You Hear Us, Real America? NYT Loved the Mighty SP.”
(11:18 AM) jillysp: yeah
(11:18 AM) jillysp: it’s like
(11:18 AM) jillysp: on their blogroll / research RSS is some dippy fan blog (HU)
(11:18 AM) jillysp: but not the NYT?
(11:18 AM) jillysp: really?
(11:19 AM) jjb: i’ve seen a lot of music news sites recapping the NYC shows saying something generic like “the shows are getting awful reviews” citing RS and fluxblog. and it’s like, hello, the greatest newspaper in the world, whose critic has seen and heard more than those guys put together, thought it was great
(11:19 AM) jillysp: lol
(11:20 AM) jillysp: it’s awful
(11:20 AM) jjb: did we figure out who picked us up first? i was assuming it was blabbermouth, maybe because they saw the post i did a few days ago that was critical of them
(11:20 AM) jjb: and then RS/stereogum took it from there, just off the news feed
(11:20 AM) jillysp: they don’t cite each other
(11:20 AM) jillysp: so it’s tough
(11:21 AM) jillysp: i wonder if my reader will tell me to the minute
(11:21 AM) jjb: i know, RS’s post was 80% a rewrite of mine, and they didn’t stoop to acknowledge that, didn’t say the words “Hipsters United”, they just linked to me inline with text
(11:22 AM) jjb: which we would actually never do to them. who are the real journalists?
(11:26 AM) jjb: actually looks like stereogum was first
(11:26 AM) jjb: which makes sense because they had the most direct quotation/citation of us
(11:27 AM) jjb: but is also interesting because i don’t think they’ve ever taken from us before. maybe they discovered us via matthew perpetua’s tumblr
(11:27 AM) jillysp: i saw your comment yesterday on WaPo
(11:27 AM) jjb: ugh, the one i doubleposted, thus ruining all its impact
(11:28 AM) jjb: too bad, it was a good slam
(11:28 AM) jillysp: i know, i just showed it to my coworker
(11:28 AM) jjb: i thought i’d hit preview and then it was lost
(11:28 AM) jjb: that happened to me the other day on SP.com, so i had that on the mind
(11:28 AM) jjb: stupid
(11:29 AM) jillysp: GO TO THA PIGGLY WIGGLAY
(11:30 AM) jillysp: (grocery store banner ads)
(11:30 AM) jjb: lol
November 14th, 2008 at 4:13 pm
melabonbon - I am going to the San Diego show :)
redmond - Your right. I did not mean to say “real” fan…I meant a fan of the kazoos. I am not big on the kettle drum myself…but if it’s the worst thing that happens…I am okay with it. I was not going with any expectations. I was going to bring my kids…and my son said “you may want to reconsider bringing your 12 year old daughter” because I could be sitting near a guy that is yelling like that the whole time.
I think it’s easy to be critical of any band or anyone. I am not standing up there facing the crowd and working that hard. Everyone has the right to their opinion. I don’t think I would have cared to hear it screaming from behind me through the show.
I’d like to hear some suggestions as to what you would have done differently? What would have worked instead to make EVERYONE happy? After watching their DVD I know they listen to what their fans are saying?
I believe their intentions are good. I consider myself warned that there is hostility at the shows. Some people are not able to contain their anger and frustration. Some people are not able to contain themselves having a good time…with a few kazoos.
I am still going…
Peace
November 14th, 2008 at 5:42 pm
Something is definitely going wrong here. I’ve seen the Pumpkins several times, the last being the Zeitgest tour and I must admit that they did indeed rock HARD. They played a great mixture of all albums, spanning the entire career and I was extremely pleased.
Billy has always been a little bitch though. I have an incredible amount of respecr for his ability and ideas, but he’s a bitch, and I’ve witnessed it in person firsthand. The new era Billy seems more wretched and grumpier than ever. He’s ego tripping a little too hard and those leather skirts are annoying as hell.
Billy, please dawn your colorful corduroy jeans and paisley polyester long sleeves. Shit, you can even wear the Zero shirt and silver plants, but the black skirts are weak, dude.
November 14th, 2008 at 7:39 pm
the dc101 interview with the heckler….relive the magic
http://www.dc101.com/cc-common/mediaplayer/player.html?redir=yes&mps=&mid=http://a1135.g.akamai.net/f/1135/28925/1h/cchannel.download.akamai.com/28925/2079/richmedia/pumpkin_heckler.mp3?CCOMRRMID=22203052&CPROG=RICHMEDIA&MARKET=WASHINGTON-DC&NG_FORMAT=aor&NG_ID=wwdc101fm&OR_NEWSFORMAT=&OWNER=2079&SERVER_NAME=www.dc101.com&SITE_ID=2079&STATION_ID=WWDC-FM&TRACK=heckler_2
November 17th, 2008 at 4:51 pm
[…] to the recent audience-heckling-the-band incidents in DC and NYC, the audience at Indian reservation-and-casino Mohegan Sun was polite and […]
November 19th, 2008 at 5:47 pm
I can’t wait for the LA show, kazoo encore and all. I’ll be sure to bring one myself.
November 21st, 2008 at 11:04 pm
[…] Corgan but was the previous night’s show, and…let’s allow Calvin in Washington to straighten this out himself: To […]